Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
230
   |
Posted - 2013.06.21 03:00:00 -
[1] - Quote
^ is a sentiment that you will read on the forum every time someone brings up AV versus Vehicles. I find it curious that this seems to be the logic that many people jump to as a way of being more cool headed. This is admirable, of course. It is better to offer a simple solution than just to cry foul about A) AV Grenades are capable of killing a Tank with almost no investment, B) AV SP and ISK cost is like 1/5 of what it is for Pilots, C) It does too much damage, or D) some combination of A-C.
It seems to make sense: "Advanced Forge Guns are meant to kill Advanced Tanks, so of course they are going to shred basic Tanks too quickly for the Tanker to counteract. What we need is Advanced and Prototype Tanks."
I have never really accepted this as a real solution. I can really understand why people get to that reasoning but I do not see it working out that way, for a myriad of reasons as well as a few problems with the above sentiment.
- How can Prototype Tanks be balanced to be able to hold/react against Prototype AV weapons while not just running over public matches? The primary reason why Tanks were nerfed the Uprising match is because of public matches. CCP clearly doesn't want Tanks to be the complete and total Murder Wagons. This means that the difference between a Prototype Tank and a normal Tank will likely not be too extremely.
- Looking to the Surya and Sagaris (which I am going to label as Advanced), they cost 6 times as much ISK, required ~7 times more SP investment in Caldari/Gallente Tanks (from 49,760 to 348,240), and yielded maybe 600 more HP and a slot that was secondary to what the Pilot actually wanted (High for Armor, Low for Shields). If those type of numbers return, I see minute difference in a Pilot's survivability.
- Why do people think that Advanced X is required to deal with Advanced Y? How many people have you killed that had Prototype weapons/suits while you did not? My 'Exile' Assault Rifle has killed more Prototype Suits than my Duvolle could ever hope for. No Ground Forces go Prototype Assault Suits simply to 'deal' with the Duvolle. Having the belief "AV is not a problem; the lack of Advanced Tanks is the problem" seems to fall flat in my opinion.
- This is probably just my imagine/eye for design failing but what could a Prototype Armor Tank have to fight against a Prototype AV weapon? An extra low slot might mean slightly more armor or resistance but can it make up for the 30% damage bonus that the AV weapon got from going Proto?
It is a really annoying issue, with both sides having their points. The Tanker says "We spend more ISK, more SP, and you kill us so easily" while the AV user states "Nothing else can kill you so your counter should kill you quickly." I do not know what can be done with the balance between Vehicles and AV, because I do believe it to be a little too much in the Infantryman's favor, but I do not agree that the solution is Advanced and Prototype Tanks.
I wish everyone the very best. |
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
League of Infamy
236
|
Posted - 2013.06.21 14:35:00 -
[2] - Quote
I find it amazing that people assume I am complaining over some problem. I am not. I do think that certain AV weapons are too powerful but I do not want to discuss that in this thread as I believe it can be stated elsewhere.
This thread is entirely stating to the Tanking Community, those that have said "Giving us Prototype Tanks will undo a lot of the imbalance of Tanks vs. AV as AV has Prototype and we do not."
The only negative thing I have gone with is to politely, and hopefully rationally, disagree with the idea that Prototype Tanks would be sufficiently better as to be a 'reasonable' match up against Prototype AV weapons.
I don't believe Prototype Tanks should beat AV right out.
I am not complaining about a Hard Counter.
I only believe that unless there is some drastic change in how the methodology of Tanks have been, I do not see Advanced or Prototype Tanks being much better than just a Standard Tank.
Be well. |